tv Anderson Cooper 360 CNN January 9, 2013 8:00pm-9:00pm EST
there is a wort for it. thank you. >> we begin tonight about a man whose courage is inspiring. this name is zaoon. he has raised his voice about the regime about rashaad. he has insisted in using his own name in interviews an talking about the crime he has seen his own country commit. months ago i asked him why he was risking his life by talking and in visiting we actually broadcast his name. >> when i chant i want freedom. i can hear my voice for the first time in my life. now how can i give up this? even if it costs me my life. >> imagine that.
a grown adult hearing this voice for the first time. police arrested him and today we got great news. we learned that he has been freed. he said he became seriously ill and became close to death. he is with his family tonight and his brother remains in custody. he said he last saw his brother eight days ago. you can go to a facebook page that the family has set up to help secure his release. relatives say everyone thanks viewers and cnn for keeping the story in the public eye. now, keeping them honest. the facts can be so hard to establish. one side has studies linking gun ownership with violent death.
the other side shows that when people are allowed to carry concealed weapons, violence goes down. but it is a charged subject. with the surplus of victims and loss the debate has evolved into mutually exclusive competing articles of faith. >> the only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun. >> that one view more guns in more places here is the other. >> when it come to preventing future acts of violence in our schools let me say this, more guns are not the answer. >> that was connecticut's governor. his view to the nra. each ring true. each side can point to real-life
incident to prove their point. and in a moment we will talk to mr. mccrystal. but first, take a look. >> reporter: if you wonder whether or not real people with guns really do help prevent gun violence look no further than the shooting in this teheater i december. around 9:00 p.m. 19-year-old garcia allegedly opened fire at th rehe restaura. police say when the employees fled, the shooter chased after them in the parking lot firing at them. in the chaos he also shot at a san antonio patrol car after the officer shined a light on them. he was having a difficult time dealing with the break up and that may have set him off to come over here and commit this acts. >> garcia followed the employees
into the store next door. he kept shooting as they poured out the exit doors. >> and i wouldn't have another day with my son. >> one of the flea fleeing fatr was armed. and she happened to be working security and ran toward the sound of the shooting. when she spotted the suspect coming out of the bathroom with gun drawn, she shot him four times. >> it was nerve racking and um, it was -- i'm not going to lie, it was frightening, but the training kicks in. >> garcia is charged now with attempted capitol murder. he survived, but so did everyone
else thanks to one of the good guys with a gun. as we all know, not every shooting incident ends like the one in san antonio. some might argue that good guys with a gun can make things worse. take what happened in 2011 when a lone gunman opened fire on gabrielle giffords. when jared loughner opened fire. by the time he arrived his safety was off and he was poised to fire. the trouble is he almost shot the wrong man. >> as i approached the people wrestling with him, one of the other gentlemen had gotten the
gun away from him. and i saw him holding the gun. and you know, i had my hand on my pistol. >> he has said he was lucky that i didn't shoot. listen to what he told msnbc. >> i saw another individual holding the firearm. i kind of assumed he was the shooter and i told him to drop the gun on the ground. everyone said no, no it was this guy. >> i almost shot the man shoulding the gun. >> the man that was almost shot was the real hero that tackled the real shooter. >> two very different different shootings and two armed bystanders to the rescue and the debate continues. >> and it continues and is growing. vice president biden meets tomorrow with the nra and new york's governor today called for his state to enact the toughest
assault ban in the nation. and on monday, it will be father weeks since the sandy hook shooting. perspective now. and our senior legal analyst, peter, it is interesting seeing these two different reports it is a test, a sign of how tough this debate is, and how tough a task this task force has. >> yeah, but if you notice, the first story was about a police officer. she happened to be not on duty, but she was a police officer. no one disagrees that police officers should have guns and she said her training kicked in. i bet you looked long and hard for a story like that. it was a police officer. i don't think anyone is arguing that police officers shouldn't be armed. the second one seems to be more
like the actual situation that you get when you have lots and lots of individuals running around playing vigilante. >> there were those that said we were afraid to tell that story because they point to that as a sign of people being arm sunday a go armed is a good idea. you say there is more common ground and things that the president could do by executive order that the nra would give a thumbs up to. >> it may sound shocking. i'm less interested in the politics in tomorrow. the president has taken flack from people like mayor bloomberg. but there are things like enforcement. 77,000 people have lied on criminal background checks on whether they could legally obtain a gun. they have been identified by the fbi and not prosecuted by the
department of justice. and there are also the national instant criminal background check mechanism is not fully funded by the government but could be and that could pro prevent people like the shooter at virginia tech. it would have sent a red flag that there is mental illness in his background and maybe he shouldn't be able to buy a gun. >> i totally disagree. there is no common ground in this argument. >> the there is zero. the national rifle association and most of the united states congress is against any sort of regulation of guns. period. >> that is simply not true. david keen on this channel, on cnn said he is in favor of people with mental illness be
registered. >> he wants the loop hole of 40% of people who buy guns not to have a background check. >> that is a different point. >> do you want to register people, i mean that is a non starter -- you can't have a database on people with guns or anybody who has received psychiatric counseling. >> the nra is in favor of it. to say that there is no common ground is defeating the purpose of this exercise. you know the nra leadership at times defers from the nra membership. the truth is, there are nra members who are willing to maybe reasonable concessions. >> name one republican member of congress who is for any form of gun control today. >> some of the few from remaining from the northeast. >> and mark kirk and susan
collins. you can go through the list flt by the way. this is not a republican and democratic issue. >> john boehner, having been humiliated in this situation is going to have to find a situation in which he would allow a vote in the house. and his own majority is impossible to imagine that happening. >> what do you think is going to happen? >> nothing. >> the obama administration is going to tee it up and bring it to 2014. i think they do believe that the politics of this have shifted enough that they can make some republicans pay a price for not being willing to hold a vote. >> the democrats not mauled at the polls afterwards and a lot of people remember that and you are right, a lot of democrats don't want to touch this issue either. but i'm saying there is no common ground here. the people don't want gun control and they recognize that
they will pay a price politically for supporting it. >> i think it is a total -- >> in 1994, there are not as many conservatives in those districts. we see them moving in response to the connecticut shooting. >> if we don't address it we will get nowhere. >> what are the guidelines on how far the government can go by restricting gun opi ownership. >> when you talk about banning ownership. president obama can't do that by himself. guns are portable. new york and andrew cuomo can pass all the laws that they want. as long as they are legal in
other states, they come up here and they can be used. unless states regulate it -- >> project exile, they prosecuted state violations. they ended up locking up local criminals in federal courts to get them off the streets and the carry rate diminished by 50%. there are federal things that this administration can do now that don't require passage of congress. >> we could still say that because 40% of at guns are bought as a show where there is no background check all the best enforcement wouldn't solve all of those becoproblems. wal-mart has been economic incentive to endlet gun show loop hole so that people buy their guns at wal-mart. if wal-mart gets behind the idea
of saying that all guns have to be sold in a place that forces you to make a background check. >> it has changed. you know for 100 years the idea that the second amendment gave anyone an individual the right to keep and bear arms was a fraud. the idea that the second amendment gave you any rights at all. but a lot of republicans started making the argument that it was the militias and in 2008 the supreme court agreed and said yes, you do have an individual right. the extent of that right has not been clarified. individuals have handguns inside the home and can they have concealed carry laws. those are still up for grabs and
you know, even if congress manages to pass something. >> justice scalia also said the bill of rights does not guarantee. the second amendment has limits. >> thank you. let us know what you think. follow me on fwtwitter. and we have a big interview comicome coming up. former general stanley mccrystal. we will be right back. at 1:45, the aflac duck was brought in with multiple lacerations to the wing and a fractured beak. surgery was successful, but he will be in a cast until it is fully healed, possibly several months. so, if the duck isn't able to work, how will he pay for his living expenses? aflac. like his rent and car payments? aflac.
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come between us and what we love. so if you're one of them people who gets heartburn and then treats day after day... block the acid with prilosec otc and don't get heartburn in the first place! [ male announcer ] one pill each morning. 24 hours. zero heartburn. president obama's choice to not leave any military presence behind by 2014. that idea was floated by the white house this week. we will also talk about his new memoire. but i want to begin by asking him about the weapons that he used during his long career. and whether civilians ought to
be able to use them. >> what do you think when you see civilians using these weapons. >> they fire at 3,000 feet per second. when it hits human flesh it is devastating. it is designed to be that way. that is what i want soldiers to car yixt but i don't want that on our streets. it is not a complete fix to just address assault weapons. but if we don't get serious now, when we see children being buried then i can't think of a time when we should. >> so you don't buy the argument? >> i don't. i think it is not a question of no guns in america or all guns. >> nobody is talking about taking away all guns.
>> i think assault weapons are not things that i'm comfortable having in places around my family. >> let's talking about afghanistan, the idea that there will be no u.s. troops there in 2014. can you foresee from a military standpoint where there would be no u.s. troops after 2014? >> i think i certainly wouldn't try to second guess what commanders on the ground are analyzing right now. >> when i arrived early after the fall of the taliban the country was devastated physically and traumatized psychologically. it was a basket case. and normal was everything before 1978. that was 23 years at the time and now it is 34. people couldn't remember normal. they have made a lot of progress. there are girls in school.
it is imperfect and now they are scared of 2014 because there is a lot to lose now and they had this chaotic 34 years and the afghan people don't want to lose it. i think instead of just troop numbers what the afghan people want is a partnership which is a relationship that gives them the confidence that we are enough of a partner that if they need our help, not thousands of troops not even billions of dollars but some sort of presence and relationship. >> how do you have that relationship when you have afghan soldiers and police killing nato forces and u.s. personal? i mean there is a huge amount of distress probably more than there has ever been. >> we have to work through that. >> our whole program is building up afghan security forces and
yet now we stop going on patrol with these guys. >> they did. but i think the wider story is more complex. you have been there. you know there is an awful lot of good. i think we have to look at it ho lis tri holistically. >> your strategy was protect the population, build of confidence in local governments and the central government as well. and extend it out where it hadn't been an go after the taliban. defeat the taliban and defeat them. that is not the strategy anymore. it has gone by the way side and now defeat al qaeda and limit al qaeda and built up security forces. i don't hear people talking about winning these days. >> when i was in iraq
particularly with special operations, i was in charge of a very kinetic operation there. >> and a lot of your book focuses on that. >> when i got to afghanistan, i realized that the taliban is not this national liberation front, they are unpopular. they are mistrusted because of how poorly they governed before and how extreme they are. what they want is a reasonable legitimate government and of course they are struggling to have that. but in my view, the right approach was to protect the afghan people and give them a people to believe. >> you go out and you spend all day going out to an isolated village at great risk to marines on the ground and have a meeting
with local elders and they hadn't seen the government in that area in a long time and you go to kabul and you wonder where is the money going? >> it is hard and there have been a lot of mistakes made. and when the united states entered we didn't understand the country or the problem well enough. if you went to the area today it is better. it is not perfect. but progress is slow. just because it is hard and takes a long time doesn't mean it isn't important. >> you can't do that, the whole idea of building up the government you can't do that without troops on the ground. so if we are pulling out, whether we leave no troops or 6,000 troops or 15,000 troops what is the mission? >> as i outlined in the book, in the fall of 2009, when i asked
the president to approve the forces they were a bridge to create and grow aftghan securit forces. there has been a lot of progress but i think it is time that the afghan government stand on its own as much as possible. but i think they can do an awful lot of it themselves. >> in the book you write about the distrust about the military and the united states and the obama white house and the distrust that it hurt early on based on the politics of the operation. i'm not -- i don't want to misquote you. you talked about um, where are my notes the decision making process on afghanistan that is what the distrust was based on. was that, you don't go into too much detail?
what does that mean? >> the term i used was lack of trust and trust deficit. i consider that different from mistrust. when you have a new administration, sit a team that has to come together and build links among itself and build trust over time. it comes in and works. it takes time to build a team and time to build trust. >> but you can build trust quickly if you feel the person isn't talking out the side of their mouth and leaking stuff to reporters. did you feel that the political apparatus understood the military? >> i'm not sure you can build trust as quickly as you say. i think you build trust when you speak the same language. it takes a while to grow together. look at president abraham
lincoln. it took him quite a while to grow as commander in chief. and it took a while for them to grow. it was probably 1863 before those two elements became a team. >> i think it has grown. i think maturation of all of the players i think one of the things i would stress more is building trust between leadership and my command. >> it did require a large number of troops and thosome argued fo on air strikes. did you have doubts about it? did you wish you could continue that strategy? >> well, to answer the second part, yes, i do. it was the only strategy we had to win the support of the afghan population. they are the point of it all. >> again, these guys are on the
fence. you guys are going to leave and you leave tonight and the tall began comes back tomorrow. >> if i'm a 50-year-old afghan living in marsha and americans come in and we say we want you to do this but the taliban come at night i don't have a choice. a lot of afghans have been put in that position. only if there is enough security. and the government believes in it do they have a strong ability. it is difficult to judge afghans who act rationally. why won't they fall incompletely with the government. >> they are in a position to do that. >> fascinating book. i appreciate you coming onto talk about it. >> coming up a former fbi agent who vanished in iran. this week his wife christine, released these photos in
to see some photos. imagine if this were your husband or father and saying i'm here in guantanamo, do you know where it is. this is the result of 30 years serving for usa. the images and words disturbing saying why you cannot help me. this one referencing how long he has been missing. you can't and don't want? his family says he was working as a private investigator looking into cigarette smuggling. in 2010 his family received this video it too was received anonymously. last year the family plastered times square with missing posters. iran's president was in town at
that time. here is what he said. >> i remember that last year iranian and american intelligence groups had a meeting but i hadn't followed up on it. i thought they had come to some kind of agreement. u.s. officials believe he is being held somewhere in southeast asia. >> christine, you received these photos of your husband in 2011 why did you choose to release them now? >> i want people to know there is still a hostage in iran. and that is my husband. >> you have no doubt that he is being held in iran? >> i do not. >> what makes you so sure? >> bob went to keish island for a 24 visit and he has not been seen since he left there. >> that is iranian territory.
>> right. >> and less than a month after he went missing on march 9th there was an article in an iranian sanctioned newspaper that said he would be released in a couple of days but that has not happened. >> has the iranian government ever communicated with you? i spokesman said he is not in iran. >> yes, i have talked to them. and there may be no evidence that he is in iran. but there is also no evidence that he is not. >> how closely is the state department working with you what are they telling you? >> well, the state department is trying to resolve this through diplomatic channels. i feel that they need to be much
more vocal about the case in order to get bob home safely. >> how are you holding up? i know your oldest daughter is getting married in feb? how are you getting through? >> we keep working one day at a time. i would like it to happen tomorrow. so would the rest of my family but we keep hoping it will be tomorrow. >> were the photos sent directly to you? >> yes, to my e-mail. >> when you open up that e-mail, what was that like to see that? >> it was um, heart breaking and yet good because it indicated that he is alive and we had had very little proof before we received these pictures and the video. we had none. >> this broadcast is seen around the world. if there is anybody involved watching this or if your husband
is able to watch this is there anything you want to get across. >> well, i want bob to know that we love him and we miss him every day and we will never stop looking for him. please stay well so that we can get you home safely. >> and i guess some people may ask why you waited so long to release the photos, what was the thinking on not releasing the photos earlier? >> well they came to us but no indication on what we were supposed to do with them or what they wanted as a result of gives us these pictures. so we chose to hold on to them because they were disturbing. at the time we thought it would be best. now we need the public to know that he is still a captive. >> christine levinson, i'm sorry for what you are going through. we will continue to follow this. thank you so much.
>> thank you. >> imagine that six whole years. just ahead. new details about lance armstrong's alleged intimidation of teammates and he is going to do an oprah interview next week and how much will come out of that interview. we will talk about that when we come right back. ♪ [ male announcer ] how do you turn an entrepreneur's dream... ♪ into a scooter that talks to the cloud? ♪
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lance armstrong is going to do an interview on aoprah. will he actually confess to doping and in what kind of detail? there is growing speculation that he will in some level of detail. it will be his first interview since he was stripped of his wins and details. he is not the only speaking out. in an interview. he talked about armstrong's cycling history and how he intimidated other riders could keep them quiet. >> was lance armstrong permanentper
personally involved in intimidating other riders to keep them quiet? >> he was. they were scared of the repercussions of simply telling the truth. >> his agency laid out the story last fall in documents of testimony. rider was one of the first to testify against armstrong. betsy joins me. we heard travis talk about armstrong tintimidating other riders and to any one else that might sound crazy. but you lived this. you said he tried to destroy you to hearing him admit to taking drugs. what did he do? >> well, e-mail accounts were
hacked and i filed a police report. we went through -- we hired attorneys so we could discover who hacked into our e-mail account. we spent thousands of dollars and got nowhere. he not a text from lance in spanish and it said "caution". i received numerous phone calls throughout the years. they have stopped. in the past couple of years and it is just the threat of we see what lance has done with other people whether it is with us, and the loss of jobs, with franky having his career derailed because erohe road the 2000 tour clean and refused to
get into doping with lance. >> when you hear the things that have been said and testified to the public image that lance armstrong has traitcated of him seems to be at such odds. >> well that is true and because he created the perception and reality were different. so the person you see is the image he wants you to see. he is a camillion. if he wants you to like him and if you are an important member of the media or a politician and if you are wealthy and he can use you he will be charming. and if he wants to bully you then he can be intimidating and very, very mean. >> you broke the news last week that armstrong was considering
whether to admit to doping. what do you think he is going to say with oprah? do you think this is kind of a full admission interview? or how do you think he is going to play this? >> that really depends on your definition of full admission. how big it will be is up to anyone's guess. but will he detail to any one's doping, this secret blood transfusions the needles in the arm that he took for epo and will he talk about people like betsy and her husband franky that he tried to crush because they dared to say that he was doping. i don't think that ep ra will get into that. >> my question is how detailed is oprah going to get in her questions. if you read these reports the
details are so damming and i would be curious to hear any questi answers he has to the questions do you think this will be a cake walk pour h walk for him? >> i do think that. i base that on the interview she did with marion jones. she did not know the sport well enough and didn't know what questions to ask. in 2011 oprah welcomed and embraced lance on her program when he was under a federal criminal investigation and never asked him about it. and he was on her show a number of times and if oprah did ask the question, i think she took him at face value despite the fact that there were books
written on his doping and the detail. a lot of what has come out now is not new. a lot is new, but there is a lot of stuff that has been out there. the question is why has it taken so long to get out here. >> and the fact that he chose somebody like oprah instead of going onto "60 minutes" speaks volumes as well. >> it isn't anything. every time we do this, i get in none dated by tweets saying leave him alone. he has done so much. do you find there is still a huge ground swell of people who don't believe that he doped? >> i actually do. believe it or not. after all the reporting that we have done. >> you can't read the hundreds of pages of documents and not see there is a lot of smoke there and there is fire.
>> i think people who don't want to know. people who saw him as an inspiration. they don't want to know. i'm not sure if they will be tuning in at all. but next thursday we will see something from lance. whether it is a full admission whether he has tears and things that make him seem contrite. but it is a first step in people believing that he actually lied to the american public and really to the world for more than a decade. >> julia and betsy. i appreciate talking to you tonight. thank you so much. >> thanks anderson. >> you are welcome. >> we will be watching. coming up. you bailed them out then, aig say they might sue the government. next their decision. now count the number of buttons on your tablet. isn't it time the automobile advanced?
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dallas maverick's owner has been fined $50,000 over a tweet. he tweet thad he failed miserableably in his attempt to fix the officiateing in his league. he has been fined millions of dollars as a team owner. >> coming up. theory dick list is next. stion. every day. when you have the most advanced tools, you want to make something with them. something that helps. helps safeguard our shores. helps someone see through a wall of fire. helps those nowhere near the right doctor stand a chance. ... feeling in the extremities ? no. technology can do that. who can tell me the third life cycle stage of the frog ?
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